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This is what happens if you are the luckiest guy on Earth when you screw up a loop in a trike.

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  • Larry  Mednick
    by Larry Mednick 7 years ago
    That is as close to a tumble as you can get without going into an irrecoverable tumble all of the way to the ground. Unless the wing collapses before you hit the ground... Then it may not tumble all of the way down to the ground
  • Steve Bell
    by Steve Bell 7 years ago
    Square onions!! Man I had that sick feeling that you get! you know??? why why why would anyone want to try to do this? How about you Larry, you know a few tricks and are pretty good at em, would you ever try that in the Revo?
  • Victor Agadzi
    by Victor Agadzi 7 years ago
    The guy has balls. Wonder if he has a BRS on board. Hey as reckless as he is , the guy deserves some credit. Awesome flying skills especially recovering from that tumble...
    Maybe very lucky...
    Stupid, Reckless, Crazy,name it he got it, but you gotta have some skills and KAHOONAS( LARGE BALLS) pumping lots of testosterone, to do that kind of stuff.Something someone suicidal would try just before his decision to go yonder..
  • Larry  Mednick
    by Larry Mednick 7 years ago
    The problem with doing a loop in a trike is if you go negative at the top you generally die, it is also hard to control your exit speed and very easy to go above maneuvering speed or even VNE on the exit. Many accomplished trike pilots might be able to do a loop, but most might only be able to stay within the listed above limits 99 out of 100 times. It only takes one time wrong and it's OVER. I certainly wouldn't bet my life on those odds...

    Asking if the Revo or I could do loops in a Revo is kinda like asking a guy who owns a Ferrari if he can jump it over the tripple at a motocross track.

    A why would you do that? It's not a dirt bike. It's not made to jump.
    B a dirt bike is made for that purpose.

    In conclusion. Trikes are NOT made to go upside down. Can they? Sure... And Ferraris can fly through the air and land on the dirt... They make stunt planes for looping and dirtbikes for jumping. Trikes, like sports cars are great, safe fun when used appropriately for their intended purpose.
  • Captain X
    by Captain X 7 years ago
    Thank you Larry, that's what I would have liked to have said.

    Doing something a bunch of times (say 20 or so) without "anything" happening feels like it must be OK / safe-- Like, "Ah, I've done that a bunch of times, no problem!! Here watch me do it again!". 99% FEELS like a good odds ratio. But, thank you for reiterating that 99% is NOT ACTUALLY a good odds ratio when life is on the line. Ole (& I) wouldn't be here if Hang Gliding was only 99% safe, we would've met the 1% the first year- heck, I probably made 100 flights my first 6 months (when I had practically zero skills), yet everyone tells us Hang Gliding is "CRAZY!" ;)

    Since it's hard to be sure of the odds of success of any particular decision, personally my comfort zone is found where there is a "Plan B" available. I'll fly very low, IF (plan B) I can land right there. I'll fly over water if (plan B) I can glide to land. etc. As you said, no amount of skill can fix a blown loop- there is no plan B (unless you include the hope that you can get to your BRS (not seen in these 2 videos) while tumbling and that it without tangling from a tumble. With a plan B a possibly safe activity becomes statistically a much safer activity.

    The funny part of this video is when, the trike just happens to tumble / flop back to straight & level and then the previously super ballsy pilot flies so perfectly straight babying his overstressed trike off the end of the video so he can ever so gently land it and change his underwear! ;)
  • Abid Farooqui
    by Abid Farooqui 7 years ago
    Haha. That guy almost lost it towards the end and then he flew straight forward. Nice. That's an Aeros Stream wing btw. Lucky bugger.
  • Victor Agadzi
    by Victor Agadzi 7 years ago
    I and am sure we all believe that his recovery was shear luck.. Something could have given at any time...and the rest would be history..another lost pilot (hopefully without a passenger) Aeros does make great wings, but coming from Ukraine, I'm not too crazy about how the broken economy at some point affected quality of production. Also, BRS's could not be relied upon since,yes, they could get tangled real quick, but makes more sense to at least have that one last option available if you are crazy enough to do this.
    In the future ,who knows..Trikes may evolve to become aerobatic: have features like the ability to efficiently and quickly engage a locking mechanism that would at the appropriate moment lock your wing in Roll ,whilst maintaining pitch control, thus allowing a loop to be performed without fear of the carriage collapsing into the wing.(Very Unlikely..) Safer wings capable of higher stress loads(actually tested) will have to be developed for that purpose...and more redundancy built into engines lessening chances of power failure especially just as you are about to go over(Very Bad )..
    Larry and Abid. new project for you...Aerobatic Trikes..
  • Steve Bell
    by Steve Bell 7 years ago
    Good answer Larry
  • Paul Hamilton
    by Paul Hamilton 7 years ago
    It is very interesting how different the opinions are about what is safe, stupid, crazy and/or irresponsible and how emotional people get bout their individual opinions/limits.. Many people think a trike pilot is stupid for flying those things in the first place. Hmmmm... Are we all stupid or crazy? We all have our own limits, opinions, mouths and keyboards.
  • Captain X
    by Captain X 7 years ago
    Huh?! I must not be reading this right. Could you clarify?
  • Robert Wascher
    by Robert Wascher 7 years ago
    Weeeeeeeee!!!! WEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!
  • Ted  Bailey
    by Ted Bailey 7 years ago
    This pilot was way to slow over the top even in the first loop. Great footage it shows not every blown loop ends in a tumble and certain death. Luck? or was it skill that saved the day? Not the wing for this type of fun. 99 out of 100? It might well be 997 out of 1000 if your calculating odds on skill level not luck. Too bad that is the only way to learn in the current system. Safety tip of the day "Do not do linked loops" make each one a stand alone maneuver. If you have to wind it up with a
    wing-over or some other type of maneuver then you are using the wrong wing. Loops are nice and round without the altitude loss and egg shape, no stress or damage to the wing or pilots seat. Just for fun! no other reasons needed.

    It looked to me like the pilot induced some roll before he ran out of speed and
    then held on to the bar, that is what saved him.
  • Qazi  Ajmal
    by Qazi Ajmal 7 years ago
    it is difficult to do such kind of stuff on a trike, because it is made of two parts frame and wing, one can do easily to make a loop when both the parts are in a fix position. did anybody have some idea to modify trike for aerobatics.
  • Abid Farooqui
    by Abid Farooqui 7 years ago
    It is -NOT- skill that kept that dude alive. The Aeros Stranger wing he is flying is about good in energy retention as any at the time. There is no "right" wing on a trike right now to do loops. Every time is a big chance. If the loop goes negative which it does many a times, there is a big chance of a bad story. Tou simply do not have the control available to get out of it. It doesn't matter how many loops and experience you have on hang gliders. Hang gliders have a very different loading on them. He'd need to bench press about 550 pounds to say that was -SKILL- there that saved him. Certainly if you asked Aeros wing designers who know this guy (as their dealer) they'd tell you that it wasn't his skill that saved him there. This video has gone around before.
  • Abid Farooqui
    by Abid Farooqui 7 years ago
    From EAA World. An experienced HG Record holder pilot dies in a tumble in a trike in Alaska:
    NTSB Final: Trike Fatality Caused by Tumble On March 13, 2010, a ski-equipped Antares trike impacted terrain about two miles north of the Birchwood Airport in Chugiak, Alaska. The aircraft was substantially damaged, and the experienced 54-year-old private pilot was fatally injured. There were no witnesses, and initially the cause of the accident eluded investigators. There was evidence of in-flight airframe failure.

    The pilot was found about 10 feet from the wreckage, but there were no tracks in the snow and the automotive-style seatbelt had apparently failed (the Plastic auto style push-button buckles had broken).

    Some weeks later a digital video camera that had been mounted on the trike was found at the site after a snow melt, and investigators learned the camera had captured the tragic crash.

    The pilot was said to be highly experienced in hang gliders and in paragliders, holding numerous state records. He had flown trikes for about 10 years. The video revealed the craft had flown well outside the normal operating envelope and entered a tumble modeĀ which is known to be possible in hang gliders and trikes but is seldom witnessed. Investigators were suspicious that this might have been the case because the wing breakage was almost identical to a prior UK tumble accident report. All of the upper and lower flying wires were intact and still attached. But the trike control bar was broken, and the internal backup safety cable was severed.

    The video revealed the trike had been flying at a low altitude over the snow-covered flats when it entered a steep climbing right turn that continued to nearly 90 degrees. The climb appeared to stop at which point the nose fell through the horizon rapidly. A frame-by-frame analysis of the video confirmed the in-flight breakup characteristic of the tumble mode which is said to be capable of reaching a rotation rate of 400 degrees per second in the longitudinal axis.

    During the tumble, the camera mount broke and the camera departed the aircraft, but it continued to record as it fell alongside. The camera attained a position below the aircraft and showed the pilot separate from the aircraft above the treetops or about 80 feet from the impact surface. The tumble mode can be triggered in weight-shift trikes and hang gliders when the wing stalls at extreme bank angles or extremely high pitch attitudes, or when the pilot attempts aerobatic maneuvers. You can see an example of a trike tumble here. For more details about the accident, read the National Transportation Safety Board report.
  • Abid Farooqui
    by Abid Farooqui 7 years ago
    In a loop the only thing keeping a trike or pilot for that matter from falling into the wing is the following
    mV^2/R > mg
    m is mass
    V is velocity
    R is radius of the loop-de-loop
    g is acceleration due to gravity

    About the only thing in a trike the pilot has any input in is that "V"
    One mis-management of this V and you go in an uncontrolled mode in a trike usually resulting in a tumble.
    That's the bottom line. That however, is not the case in an airplane.
    In roller coasters, the loops are never perfect round circles. That simply doesn't work. Round circled loops won't keep you pushed into your seats. Do the Physics and solve the equations for centripetal and centrifugal (imaginary) forces and you will see why this is wrong. The guys designing the loops in roller-coasters also have the job of keeping people pushed into the seats (maintain positive G's) and actual looping roller coasters follow a "clothoid curve" which is a "teardrop shaped" circular loop. If they don't do that they go back to the days of roller coaster accidents with circular loops.

    I just wanted to point out this not to encourage anyone to attempt loops while maintaining positive G's in a trike but to clear some completely incorrect posts that were posted suggesting perfect circles and so on as good loops for maintaining control. Perhaps in a parallel universe with different Physics?

    Check out Clothoid Roller Coaster Loops Explained
  • Mike-in- Thailand
    by Mike-in- Thailand 7 years ago
    Furthermore, if your loop is a good one and, if you survive all the other pitfalls at the top of the arc, you should get a few decent kicks as you pass through your own wake turbulence on the exit.
  • Abid Farooqui
    by Abid Farooqui 7 years ago
    Here is one picture showing the seatbelt receiving buckle (auto style) that broke during the above listed Alaska tumble from a badly attempted aerobatic maneuver:

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